A bit upset with register.dot-bit.org

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gavin
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A bit upset with register.dot-bit.org

Post by gavin » Sat Nov 30, 2013 1:53 am

Back in April 2012, I paid 1.5 btc for a dot-bit domain. In an email from Khalahan I was told I would receive further instructions. I never did.

After numerous (unanswered) emails to Khal & Dot-bit.org, I feel cheated. I also believe my dot-bit domain has since been taken by someone else, which is a double-insult.

I'm upset with Khal and dot-bit.org. I am still very excited about the namecoin project, and will continue to take part in the future. Even so, this process has definitely left a bad taste in my mouth.

If anyone has advice, I'm all ears. Thanks.

domob
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Re: A bit upset with register.dot-bit.org

Post by domob » Sat Nov 30, 2013 10:18 am

This is the danger in using third-party services to register .bit domains (apart from them being hugely overpriced usually). In principle this is the same as using online wallets (think inputs.io, for instance) with Bitcoin, rather than something where you own the private key yourself. The best is to download namecoind / Namecoin-Qt and register domains yourself with NMC. I think it isn't any longer very complicated, especially with the UI.
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biolizard89
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Re: A bit upset with register.dot-bit.org

Post by biolizard89 » Sat Nov 30, 2013 10:22 am

gavin wrote:Back in April 2012, I paid 1.5 btc for a dot-bit domain. In an email from Khalahan I was told I would receive further instructions. I never did.

After numerous (unanswered) emails to Khal & Dot-bit.org, I feel cheated. I also believe my dot-bit domain has since been taken by someone else, which is a double-insult.

I'm upset with Khal and dot-bit.org. I am still very excited about the namecoin project, and will continue to take part in the future. Even so, this process has definitely left a bad taste in my mouth.

If anyone has advice, I'm all ears. Thanks.
I'm not going to defend the way this was handled, and it appears (from the limited info I have) that you're not the only case of this happening. I do know that khal has been unavailable for development work for over 1.5 years, and seems to have very little time these days. For what it's worth, I never used the register.dot-bit.org service because it was overpriced and I didn't want to trust any 3rd party -- so I downloaded namecoind and one of the GUI's and bought my domain with NMC. Not saying this excuses what happened, but there is a reason that users are warned to avoid trusting anyone with their private keys. In any event, I agree that you should get refunded assuming that your information is accurate.

@khal, can you help gavin with this?
Jeremy Rand, Lead Namecoin Application Engineer
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indolering
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Re: A bit upset with register.dot-bit.org

Post by indolering » Fri Feb 14, 2014 8:30 pm

domob wrote:This is the danger in using third-party services to register .bit domains (apart from them being hugely overpriced usually). In principle this is the same as using online wallets (think inputs.io, for instance) with Bitcoin, rather than something where you own the private key yourself. The best is to download namecoind / Namecoin-Qt and register domains yourself with NMC. I think it isn't any longer very complicated, especially with the UI.
There shouldn't be a danger in trusting the main developer of the protocol. The real problem here was that Khal didn't try to make a profit, there is a reason that Gavin isn't running his own exchange.

Some people claim he was scamming people out of there money intentionally but I'm guessing that Khal got to busy and let it go to hell. I feel for the guy, he just got in over his head ... at least he finally turned the service off. However, he should issue a public apology explaining what happened.

I think we should also make some sort of rule that the Namecoin project itself not provide any such service and we create some sort of rules on who gets listed on the website.
DNS is much more than a key->value datastore.

indolering
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Re: A bit upset with register.dot-bit.org

Post by indolering » Fri Feb 14, 2014 8:45 pm

I would like to expand a bit on using services vs running your own client: we need reputable business that can properly manage domain registrations. Lecturing people that they should just manage it themselves is an insult to the person being lectured and demonstrates a total lack of appreciation for the user experience.

I mean, look at who you are lecturing! Other than Satoshi, Gavin is probably the most technically competent user and is fully aware of such dangers. But Gavin is also really fucking busy and doesn't want to have to download a client, find an exchange which handles Namecoin, sign up for the exchange, send BTC to the exchange and wait an 10-30 minutes for the transaction to go through, buy the Namecoin and wait another 10-30 minutes before he can send it to his Namecoin wallet, and then wait another 10-30 minutes to initiate the domain name purchase, and then wait another 10-30 to initiate the name_update request, and then remember to renew that domain every ~250 days.

I'm pretty sure Gavin has other problems to deal with. I mean, do you think he changes the oil in his car or handles his own plumbing? I know people that do those things, but they all happen to do them as part of their job or because it saves them hundreds or thousands of dollars. Time is money and Gavin can afford to spend $20 on a domain.

Just writing this makes me upset, but I guess that's why I'm a UX engineer.
DNS is much more than a key->value datastore.

biolizard89
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Re: A bit upset with register.dot-bit.org

Post by biolizard89 » Wed Feb 19, 2014 5:33 am

indolering wrote:I would like to expand a bit on using services vs running your own client: we need reputable business that can properly manage domain registrations. Lecturing people that they should just manage it themselves is an insult to the person being lectured and demonstrates a total lack of appreciation for the user experience.

I mean, look at who you are lecturing! Other than Satoshi, Gavin is probably the most technically competent user and is fully aware of such dangers. But Gavin is also really fucking busy and doesn't want to have to download a client, find an exchange which handles Namecoin, sign up for the exchange, send BTC to the exchange and wait an 10-30 minutes for the transaction to go through, buy the Namecoin and wait another 10-30 minutes before he can send it to his Namecoin wallet, and then wait another 10-30 minutes to initiate the domain name purchase, and then wait another 10-30 to initiate the name_update request, and then remember to renew that domain every ~250 days.

I'm pretty sure Gavin has other problems to deal with. I mean, do you think he changes the oil in his car or handles his own plumbing? I know people that do those things, but they all happen to do them as part of their job or because it saves them hundreds or thousands of dollars. Time is money and Gavin can afford to spend $20 on a domain.

Just writing this makes me upset, but I guess that's why I'm a UX engineer.
Umm... are you saying gavin is Gavin Andresen? To my knowledge he didn't identify himself as such.

Even if a business is reputable, they quickly become a large target... there are plenty of reputable businesses who have lost customer data to cyberattacks. Keeping the data on your own offline computer is probably the only way to prevent that.

Remembering to renew the domain every 36000 blocks is easily fixable if Namecoin-Qt is assumed to stay running; that's a UI issue. Making them auto-renew when Namecoin-Qt isn't running is still doable, but requires eliminating transaction malleability first.
Jeremy Rand, Lead Namecoin Application Engineer
NameID: id/jeremy
DyName: Dynamic DNS update client for .bit domains.

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